Social commentator speaks out
Stop criticising
Do friends/family and our partners ever have a right to criticise, or interfere if not invited? Share your stories.
A FRIEND recently stood in open judgment of me. She criticised my parenting without invitation. She’d clearly felt the way she did for a long time, given her eloquence. She also chimed in that “other people” had agreed with her, which clearly buoyed her up enough to liberally share her views.
For a few days I stewed about it, then decided it was a topic worthy of public debate. To what extent are people entitled to intrude on our lives and pass judgment or offer righteous advice on the decisions we make? I mean if our children’s lives are not at stake and we’re not heroin addicts.
A group of my friends who came for lunch weighed in on the discussion. One woman, from a southern European family, says she has an interfering family who due to cultural factors feel it’s their right to give advice on everything she does, from her choice of friends, hairstyles and work hours to the school she sends her child to. The advice is full of veiled criticism. It’s uninvited and offensive to her. As a result she lives in another state.
One of the husbands offered this: “I think it’s OK to pass judgment if it’s asked for. I’m in a men’s group and we put our stories on the table each week for scrutiny. But the guys give their views with full permission and without criticism, because that’s the rules of the group.”
The other male at the table said he didn’t think it was a good idea to be surrounded by those who only ever praise you. “People are going to say whatever they say behind your back anyway,” he added. “At least it’s honest to step forward. Otherwise the judgment comes out in sarcasm or disapproving looks.”
Here’s my view on the etiquette of judgment. No one has any right to give their uninvited opinion on how someone else lives. It’s emotional trespass. I include disdainful stares and snide remarks in this category.
The word here is boundaries. We don’t walk into people’s homes uninvited. It’s not OK to intrude on people’s souls. If we need to tell a friend or family member something we feel is of service, why not say: “I have a view on this. Is it OK to tell you what I think?” If told to shut up, promptly do so.
I wonder if anyone else feels as strongly about this as I do? US relationships and parenting expert Dr John Gottman warns that criticism ruins all relationships. Do you agree?
PLEASE COMMENT BELOW SITE
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Hi Ruth & Readers,
Since u asked…”thats a very brave “friend” u have cause when it comes to our children & any criticisms.. monsters dwell there! Confusious said “Only the very ignorant or the very wise stand their ground. When i am going to respond to others in a way they may not like, i like to ask “do u really want my opinion?” & when i receive advise that raises the shackles i reflect on who owns the problem? if its not mine, leave it, if it is, well then i’m grateful. Sadly criticisms are usually not gentle..please people be gentle with one another & with ourselves! When an untrue criticism sticks i practice changing that story to a true one. But sometimes i do need my ego rubbed with sandpaper…so Ruth the best advise..from the Buddha “take praise & criticism in the same breath” kind regards -
Dear Ruth,
I loved your column about this. I haven’t had time to read all the comments and replies but am going to print them out and do it tonight after work.
1. I think this kind of unasked-for critical behaviou is INCREDIBLY common in Australia these days for some reason. People seem to think they have the right to just comment, criticize and judge other people all the time. Maybe it’s a product of over ten years of “reality” TV shows where the judges, and audience, rate people on their performance, cooking, weight loss, whatever.
Plus I think a general loss of manners and respect for personal boundaries in society these days.
My parents generation – born pre-WW2 – had the mantra that “if you can’t say something nice, don’t say anything.2. I’ve got a sister who’s done this to me all my life, and to other people, but I’m one of the people that she’s seen the most of so I’ve copped it a lot.
She does not do it so much to men generally or her brothers, and not to young people or children (fortunately) but it’s very destructive and it’s taken me several years of psychotherapy to realize that I can’t change the way she talks to me but I can somehow decrease it’s effect on me by not internalizing her criticisms -
eg, if I have a new haircut and colour she will say I should have made it blonder/darker, longer/shorter. If I say a new TV show is good, she will automatically criticize it.
I try to use reverse psychology with her but it’s against my nature to lie or dissemble so I just now don’t give my opinions about things to her straightaway as I know she will disagree, criticise and put down my opinion.3. You wrote a great article a year or so ago re “toxic” people. These are the same people as these unasked for critics and boundary invaders.
It’s comforting to know other people are affected as I’ve been. Maybe we should form a club?
But it’s sad that people behave like this in the first place as they cause a lot of destruction in their wake.
I actually think that it’s a case of some people only feel good about themselves by making other people feel bad about themselves.Love your articles and thank you.
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We had moved to Sydney for my husband’s job and had been there about 18 months. Living in Paddington was starting to take its toll on our vivacious and free-spirited daughter (aged 9) who felt co0ped up in the terrace. So whenever we came back to our house near the beach in Coledale, north of Wollongong, she would fling open the front door at first opportunity and take off to explore, breath the fresh air and let her imagination run wild. It’s a safe, quiet area with a close knit community and she knew the place well. This is the childhood I wanted her to have as it was like mine. The freedom to explore, learn and test your own boundaries and develop a sense of independence. This wasn’t possible in Sydney and we were seriously toying with the idea of returning to Coledale full time to give her that opportunity again. However, one weekend, disaster struck when her imagination took her too far. My daughter and her friend ran up to the door and I told them they had another 15 minutes until dinner was ready. A neighbour saw them at the end of the street making flower potion. They must have then decided to quickly go up to the nearby train station – an out of bounds place, but too tempting as she and her friend had spotted a pink torch on the tracks through the gates. As they were avid “spies” and had a midnight feast planned for that night, the torch was too much too miss. My daughter, always the daring one, ran along the ramp and climbed down on to the tracks not realising the danger of the trains which are like quiet assassins. No longer are they red rattlers which you hear in the distance, but silver bullets which suddenly appear with 5 seconds warning. She was hit instantly. I am sure you can imagine the comments posted and bandied about from many who do not know us about our lack of responsibility and poor parenting. “How could I have let my daughter play on the tracks? Why on earth were they allowed to go up there? I should have known where they were at all times. They should not have been allowed out of my sight etc.” Those who do know us and share our view of giving our children freedom and a childhood like we had, have supported us. We do not want our children to sit for hours playing computer games or watching tv. I understand why the New York mother and author who made front page headlines when she let her 9 year old son ride the subway home was so surprised by the fierce criticism she received. I support her stance still today. I don’t regret my decision to let my daughter out to play. She would not have wanted anything else. In the short life she had, she was happy, free spirited with an imagination that could not be entertained by a computer game. She should not have been on the tracks, but her sense of adventure took her there and there was no way I was ever going to be able to control that and keep it locked up. Julia
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#7 written by Ruth Ostrow 1 year ago
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Thanks Ruth. I am happy to talk further and you can contact me directly at my email address if you wish. You may have questions that you feel I may not wish to discuss in an open forum just yet. General thoughts, however, I am happy to discuss on this site to share with your readers. I have always enjoyed your columns in the Australian, have read some of your books and believe I have a similar approach to life as you do. I feel confident that I can share my story with you. I completely shunned the media frenzy when the accident happened and this is the first time I have made any public comment about it. Kind regards, Julia
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How about being told by the celebrant at my partner’s dad’s funeral (after thanking her for such a lovely ceremony) that hopefully the next time she saw us would be for a wedding, and that he will make a lovely father…(we are not married and have no children)
I was too stunned to reply!
It was Hobart after all… -
I read with interest re unwanted advice, here is a curly one. My grandaughter who is 16 has been self harming and threatening suicide. Having watched her being raised over the years I can see why this is happening and I am not alone in this opinion as the rest of the family are aware of the same thing. To try and give unwanted advice has always been a no no, one wonders do you stay unconcerned and hope that she does not carry out her threat of suicide or self harm so that death occurs, and then wish some-one had offered unwanted advice, as you know death is very permanent. Your article set me off wondering, I do not want this printed.
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Ruth,
Thankyou for unveiling , those ‘well meaning’ passive-aggressive type friends and family, who yes ,’righteously’ declare their so called care and love for one by ‘trespassing’ into our lives.
This article of yours also links back to one I previously read, regarding clearing out the ‘dead wood’ of relationships was important to moving ahead in our lives with peace.
My husband and I have, in short , been struggling with the whole infertility journey bravely and as positively as any couple can faced with such insurmountable grief. We have never asked anyone in our respective lives to understand or empathise ( a rare gift in human beings) with our plight, just to allow us the space and time to slowly heal and try to restructure our lives accordly, this has not been respected alas……we have been critised for not ‘getting on with it’ and apparently ‘not living life to the fullest’ and being ‘glass half empty’ individuals ( interestingly mainly from ones who have had their parenting dreams fullfilled !!!! )…..result ? estrangement, damaged relationships never to be the same again ( not a bad thing, were they good to start with ???? at least now they are honest….) and yes, moved far away to have finally some peace and clarity. Not a bad outcome really, just sad and disappointing……..thankyou again P. -
How, I’ve stewed about this question! Being at the stage in life where I have to cover the grey hair, I thought I had learnt most lessons. However, this particular topic causes much angst. Recently, a close friend while going through a macerating divorce spent hours on the phone asking advice or ‘venting’. Now, she is in a great relationship but I saw her making ALL the same mistakes, the mistakes she vowed she wouldn’t make, yet again. Do I as a friend talk to her about it? Well, I penned (electronically!) a very gentle letter, saying I was concerned for her. She phoned to say she wasn’t happy with the email, but understood that it came from love for her. However, the truth is, I’ve FINALLY learnt the lesson. Never EVER EVER give advice unless you are point blank asked for it. Even if you feel you are ‘not being a good friend’ in keeping quiet It’s a shame but true. I certainly don’t think one should ‘comment’ on other peoples children, pets, spouses, family and their taste in art. Just keep it to yourself or talk to the flowers!
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EF: CRITICS.
Hey Ruth,
Reading between the lines of last week’s column, the critics have got you rattled, so…
As an avid reader of your column (and despiser of critics) you may wish to try this (part of my Naval training) the next time that a critic tries to rain on your parade:
Look them right in the eye, and in a firm but gentle voice, say “why don’t you F off!” (using the whole F-word of course).
This, as a surprise defence tactic, puts you well and truly back in charge.
Critics are normally insecure, non-achivers, so they don’t know what to do next.
Best of all, they’ll never pick you again.
I get rid of all my critics using similar tactics and life without critics is relaxing and far less complicated.My favourite description of a critic (metaphorically speaking) is “A person without legs who tells others how they should run”. That says it all…
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Dear Ruth,
Firstly, I look forward to your articles every week, they are always interesting and relevant. As a Psychologist, however, I would just like to make a sight clarification about the statement you made about Dr John Gottman warning that criticism ruins relationships. I think you mentioned this in a rather broad way whereas, he discusses it in the context of many other factors and not in isolation. I do agree with many of the comments above about unwanted criticism. But perhaps we need to distinguish between criticism and well-meant advice. Yes, many people do step over the mark, however, increasingly, I find that people of all ages in modern society are unable to accept or even consider any advice. We can take on or listen to whatever we choose, but without some other perspectives followed by a little introspection and self-analysis how are we ever meant to grow, develop and evolve as individuals? Instead people have become so sensitive that they close their ears at anything. The current generation is showing that they are unable to take advice and merely wave their hand to it, thus resulting in many individuals with a disproportionate view of themselves and their capabilities. I am a strong advocate for self-confidence and self-esteem, however if it does not match with reality we are only setting these people up for failure and this will lead to depression, anxiety and many other mental health issues. Again, I do think that some people offer some very unwanted, personal and quite vicious advice which I do not support. Also, linking with another recent article of yours about the age of having children and how our mothers raised children with the support of the whole community, isn’t receiving advice from others part of that community support that we are wanting? An interesting article and some interesting perspectives. -
Dear Ruth
Your comment struck a timely chord. I understood exactly how you must have felt. A long time friend and I met for coffee recently to catch up before my husband and I leave for a 1 year posting to the USA. She proceeded to make critical uninvited judgements about my daughter, her travel plans to visit us, her boyfriends intentions and my mother planning to travel solo when she visit’s us. I kept my cool but couldnt wait to leave. I felt I had been assaulted with one criticism after another. I too was seething and hurt. I have never passed judgement on her family and am quite certain she would not tolerate it. It’s sad but I won’t be making time to catch up again. There is just no pleasure in it. Thanks for raising the issue in your article Ruth. -
hi Ruth
I agree entirely with you that unasked for advice is offensive. We wonder why it is proffered in the first place! Is it just through habit and the belief that it is ok and we are being precious for being offended as is usually the case in families? Or is it an attack of some sort as it might be in the case of ‘friends’. If so, what really underlies the criticism? Is it really about us or, as I suspect, something about themselves? How arrogant is it to suppose one has the right to sit in judgement on others! Do people who do this believe they hold some position of superiority that commissions them to deliver advice and criticism? How would they feel on the receiving end? Not happy, I imagine!
If someone is affected by the behaviour of others -e.g. someone’s kid is really badly behaved or they keep interrupting you or they let you down over and over again – they need to learn how to deal with it. I have learned myself through relationship counselling that when someone is upsetting me (and we do have the right to tell someone when we are affected by them) to address the issue using ‘I’ statements; don’t accuse and dont criticise. For example, and this comes from my own personal experience, my friend is very self-centred and likes to talk about herself to the exclusion of others lots of the time. I considered dumping her but didn’t want to do that because she has other qualities I value. I stopped her one day when I felt annoyed and told her that I had to speak to her because I was upset – I said she might not like what I had to say but because we had been friends for so long I didn’t want to be feeling bad about her and would rather talk about it than resent her behind her back. I said I accepted it if she chose not to be my friend any more even though that would be awful for me but I could no longer go on feeling the resentment I felt. I then told her how I felt and that I too was important and had things to say and that I did not feel we stood on equal footing as friends. I know she wasn’t overly happy about what I told her but she accepted it and since then out friendship has actually deepened and she doesn’t hog the platform all the time! On another occasion a friend of mine let me down at the last minute and I was furious (it was an important event) and she does this too often. My counsellor suggested I say ‘ I was looking forward to seeing you and was very disappointed I didn’t get to enjoy your company that night’ and leave it at that. I did so and my friend then broke down and revealed that it was her husband who made her life very difficult (something we had long suspected anyway)
So, while we don’t have the right to barge in and overstep boundaries we all have the right to feel comfortable in our surroundings. It is up to you to know where your friend stands here – can you look dispassionately at the situation? Do your parenting habits infringe on others in the room or was she just making a moral judgement? Was her attitude offensive or was she trying to sort something out for the sake of your friendship? I really don’t like that she included “others’ (setting up a triangle to support her – not good!). If others have a problem it’s up to them to bring the matter up.
We have no right to invade the boundaries of others but we do have the right to protect our boundaries too – the secret is in interacting with respect and courtesy when dealing with difficult issues. If your friend spoke gently and with concern for how your parenting style affected her then she probably wasn’t being nasty, just a bit interfering. However, you have every right to say, well, I understand that you are free to feel …. but this is how I feel …….
Overall, however, I think commenting on how one brings up their children is a very dangerous thing to do if you want to keep your friends!!! -
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#24 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
Yes I do agree with you Kate, it can’t be taken any other way especially when forced down one’s throat. Thanks all of you for writing tonight, I appreciate your views, and again apologies I wasn’t on-line to moderate. I was at a fund raising function for the animal rights group Voiceless which was very inspiring. G’night.
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I feel for your situation. You would need support and understanding from your friends for how hard it is sometimes, not unwanted criticism.
warning – advice following, don’t read on if not wanted…..In your initial situation I wonder if showing to your friend how her critique made you feel, deep down, would bring more closeness when she sees the effect she’s had on you? Then she may open up about whats going on for her in relation to critiquing your parenting. Its also possible that she has some wisdom for you and vica versa.
my best wishes for you and your lucky children
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I have an older brother who loves me so much that he can’t stop criticising either my business, my relationships, my parenting..you name it. He waits for me to come over because he’s been up for nights, worrying about some aspect of my life that only he knows the answer to. No-one spends so much time thinking about my life than he has, even more than I do, and always it’s about what I have been doing wrong and how he can help me make whatever it is better. If only he didn’t love me quite so much! In complete contrast, my other brother never calls me, drops over or gives me a second of his time. Criticism can be an expression of love, as you know. And silence can be an expression of not caring much at all.
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#27 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
Yes that’s the double edge sword of love, so beautifully put Helen. Indifference can be the true sign of criticism. But then again, you sound like you really believe your brother loves you, and that isn’t really criticism its more that he is absorbed with you which makes you feel acknowledged. I think everything has to do with the intentions of the person doing the criticising, and we do know when we are being loved or conversely when we are being harshly put in our places.
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Dear Ruth
Your article in The Weekend Australian Magazine asking if anyone feels as strongly as you do (i do) with regards to “Want some advice?” certainly made me want to share my thoughts …. it is not right for people to judge and criticize at all. No one is perfect and sometimes there are many reasons/sides to what is going on in someone’s life. Criticizing only makes things worse. It is not helpful. If you are sincere & have pure intent you offer your love and understanding … you try to help, guide and protect. This might be just to listen & not offer any advice … let them empty their cup & empower them to work out the best solution. Especially, our children – if they live with criticism – they learn to condemn. Being a mother is the most difficult job in the world – and a mother is the first teacher of her children. You need all the encouragement & support.
People do talk behind our backs – (I feel it) – and I have learnt that it is none of my business what other people think of me and if it is negative I would rather them to keep it to themselves. However, this has taken me many, many years to master because we are humans and we like to socialize, fit-in and feel that our life is of value.
God has asked us to try very hard to treat people the way we like to be treated – with respect and dignity. Our mental peace and happiness depends and needs this. If we know we have done nothing wrong, our self-respect & confidence helps us stop letting the unkind comments from people hurt us. Their critical words are not welcome and make you feel worse (as they did – you said you “stewed” for a few days.) They break our spirit emotionally & mentally.
I believe we learn from each difficult test and we can use our tests to make us stronger.
We all make mistakes – this is how we learn. No one is perfect. To self-righteously put someone down is not respectful. It makes people miserable and it does ruin relationships and causes more pain and suffering … how can this possibly be ‘someone’s right?’
I try to turn every negative into a positive & I believe your ‘friend’ is unaware or mentally unconscious that her judgment (and “other people”) and her eloquent, liberal views of your parental skills might hurt you.
Forgive her … and do not dwell on her unkindness – use this experience to teach your children the power of living a life of unity & compassion.
We should not look at others faults … we should only look at our own.
Imagine if everyone would do this – our world would not be in so much chaos … we need to focus on living a good moral & spiritual life and not use our ‘ego’s’ to invalidate our friends and loved ones. No one has this right.
To back-bite and hurt another’s soul /spirit is cruel. We must not hurt or humiliate anyone.“Where there is love nothing is too much trouble and there always is time.”
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It’s always a balance. If a friend cares enough to approach you on such an obviously difficult subject then I recommend that you hear that friend out. It would be courteous to discuss once at least and you might come away with some new insight. You might also have to agree to disagree – this a healthy outcome too, wouldn’t you agree? Your anger and other negative emotions is really your issue. I think that it’s hard to maintain a relationship with someone who hides behind anger rather than openly dealing with issues as they arise.
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#30 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
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I’m with Colin here…. one of my favourite quotes is “everything you FEEL is your own creation”. Judgement is human and unavoidable but only you can open the gates to let it in for you to feel hurt. If you feel assured in your parenting then there would be no need to be anything but interested in another’s perspective and what may be triggering her strong feelings about it which may ultimately assist her. What about your parenting is activating such strong emotion in her… I think this is how we all learn and grow by human interaction, good, bad and ugly.
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Hi Ruth
YOu and I have both met and spoken at Mind Body Spirit in the past.
I’ve been a full time speaker for 18 years, following my 20 year legal career.
I agree that criticism ruins relationships. I am minded to share with you the wisdom of Buckminster Fuller, who was awarded 47 Honorary Doctorates and died in 1983. I share his wisdom with my audiences. His view was to never give unsolicited advice/suggestions/criticisms. As a professional adviser, I agree!
However!
Sometimes, love dictates that we take a step, and my former partner, a psychiatrist, opined that avoiding comment to a loved one can sometimes be a wimp’s act, to avoid the risk of conflict or rejection.
I reconcile this in the similar way to what you wrote in your article: ‘is it ok to make a suggestion?’, and if the answer is no, then I shut up!
Love your work
And your honesty and vulnerability
Cheers, with passion
Charles Kovess
Australasia’s Passion Provocateur-
#33 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
Thanks Charles, I do remember you and I had exactly that talk with a therapist today. She told me that it was very difficult to hold one’s tongue but that people were never ready to hear what they weren’t ready to hear so it was often offensive and a waste of time to boot. Thanks for writing, and please keep contributing, I value intelligent contributions.
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#35 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
Yes but Jane it is very different me declaring broad opinions on controversial topics as a commentator to inspire public debate, to me coming up to you personally and questioning the school you are sending your child to, or pulling some sort of judgemental face when you tell me that you’re getting your kids teeth braces. (the face being, God what a waste of money) These sorts of criticisms open or veiled get people angry and wanting to say: Mind Your Own Business! True???
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Hmmm… There is a difference between discussing, criticizing and badgering. We all think that what we feel and think is real, is ‘right’ but how does one know? Discussing with compassionate others, friends certainly helps. Reading is really chatting with someone who’s taken the time to organize their thoughts and research (though there’s a lot of rubbish been written down). Of course one does have to be receptive to new ideas and willing to reflect on one’s own behavior. If I might quote Australian Dr Julian Short, ‘Always act with kindness and dignity’. Seems to me to be good advice and those who feel compelled to ‘criticize’ and those feeling a little touchy about being criticized might achieve better outcome.
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#37 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
A big sorry to all of you because I’ve neglected my duties as moderator and not accepted your posts till this late hour. Back now. Thanks Anne and Tom and even Karlos (who isn’t at all happy with me), Megan, Nicola, Nina and Colin, hope I haven’t forgotten any one who I kept waiting these last hours! Please keep posting, I am finding your comments so interesting and challenging.
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Dear Ruth, I have never responded to a column before, but was compelled to do so after reading “Want some advice”. You use the word “friend”? Has this friend had a child or children of her own? And what about her parenting skills? If she feels so confident about dispencing advice, maybe she should write a parenting book to all those who obviously lack the necessary skills. Parenting is such a unique and personal thing, everyone is different. My opinion is that if it works for you and your child, then it is right. Obviously, if there is any danger to the child, both physically and psychologically, then common sense prevailes. Beyond that, I have two quotes: “If I wanted your opinion I would have asked for it” and my favourite, I would advise my friend “to give so much time to the improvement of yourself that you have no time to criticise others”.
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#40 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
Frank you are an anti-Semite. I am happy to have a laugh with my readers even the one’s who don’t like what I have to say but your latest post which I have withheld is blatantly racist and any form of bigotry is vile and unacceptable. My readers would be disgusted if I posted it. Whether they agree with me or not they are a fair minded intelligent bunch of people, and I doubt any one of them would condone your anti Semitic comments thrown at me because I am a Jew. Or perhaps I should send your post straight to the anti-Defamation league?
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I’m on Bill’s #27 side here to a point, as I too am a culprit….Yes, I would be the first to assert that one should never criticise another’s parenting, but what about between parents? I can’t see why both parents shouldn’t be able to constructively criticise each other, because the bottom line is it’s all about the kids, and if upsetting someone means better care for the children then I’m all for it.
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Sorry Ruth, but if you expect me or anyone else to kiss you where the rocket should go as a prerequisite to having you do what is right, then you are sadly mistaken.
The fact you see my point as valid and makes your wish for me to couch you in certain ways invalid.
Whether you are willing to look at yourself, learn and change is up to you whether I am eloquent enough to meet your superficial standards or not. Laughing out loud might make you feel better or superior for a moment or two, but the validity of what I said still stands. -
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#45 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
Hi Sue, I think you will see that I am too angry in that column to have made it up
I wished after it was published that I didn’t sound so emotional about it all. But to answer your question it is comprised of pure raw emotion, and a lack of understanding at why people even bother trying to run other people’s lives when their own are not so perfect. Thanks for asking.
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Ruth,wow, great topic.My seeming perfect mother and sister continually express criticism of my parenting, since my ex husband of 24 yrs left after finding out he was having an adulterous relationship( 7 years ago).They have never been around me or in my house hold for more than half an hour once or twice a year but apparently think a single grieving parent of grieving teenagers should grieve a certain way and act accordingly. Also similiar , recently after meeting a lovely man and having a great relationship for 2 yrs,one of his co-work friends , after meeting me for 4 hrs decided to tell him she didn’t think I made his sparkles sparkle.I am so angry at her interference, as I was a minority that day in a group of work people that I wasn’t part of and she judged me and result , relationship now over.
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I agree with Colin. To quote the magical Burt Bacharach “That’s what friends are for..”
I have a friend who is obese and drinks to excess every night of the week. She has become very reclusive and I am very worried for her mental and physical health. I feel that I should be entitled to broach the subject with her and offer my support and help in the best way I know how. I should like to think she would appreciate, if not immediately, that I come to her in love and compassion.
Having said all this, I haven’t yet offered my opinion to my old friend. I don’t want to hurt her, I don’t want to seem patronizing.
I need to get the language right, I need to be sure I’m not too confrontational. But I do think I really need to walk into her home uninvited and offer my advice and friendship. -
I was going to start a business, ‘My Honest Opinion’, because there are so many people that are walking disaster areas because nobody cares enough to have a quiet word with them. Decided it probably wasn’t a good idea, because my honest opinion could be quite biased. But I do believe that politeness has taken over honesty, and there’s a lot of people who could do with a helping hand and don’t receive it because everyone’s too polite. I think your friend cared, if they were telling you for your benefit and not their own.
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What we feel and think is transitory; it changes from moment to moment. None of us like to be criticized; but, good friends, I suggest, help keep us grounded and yes that means we wear some criticism from time to time. Indeed, if a friend won’t tell it to you straight, who will? Only wanting to hear what we like or our own views reflected back is narcissistic. I think it pays to listen to concerned others, they might just be right.
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#51 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
Good night all. Thanks for the debate today. Keep posting through the week And don’t ever hesitate giving me a serve. If you don’t mind getting one back of course. I’ve had some beauties today, but I do welcome all points of view on here and they make for interesting reading. The last wishing me a rocket up ‘where it don’t shine’, is classic. Other than answering my blog, I’ve had a hard day today – tax time. I wonder if I am the only one tied to the desk with millions of squiggly numbers on endless pieces of paper and a calculator that’s got sadistic tendencies? I shall leave that blog till another time, meanwhile have a productive week, and stay tuned….Next week’s column cosmetic surgery, to lift or not to lift? That is the question.
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Ruth: I occasionally read your columns advising others how to live thier lives and found this latest one very interesting. Anyone with any sense of community knows that it takes a village to raise a child. The fact you felt you needed to air this personal issue tells me you feel the person you descibe as a transgressor was correct in her assessment of you as a parent.
Not sure what you mean by “I mean if our children’s lives are not at stake and we’re not heroin addicts”, but it appears you think anything outside of those limits is somehow okay.
Each and every one of us is affected by the behaviour of others and this means your parenting style is my business.
I see stupidity in parenting most every day of my life where selfishness and greediness is rewarded by parents with little or no social conscience and you expect me to shut up and accept that? Grow up Ruth. Sounds like you need a rocket.
Hope this helps you grow as a person.-
#53 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
LOL! I may need a rocket, but where Karlos? I suggest you may yourself have a few issues communicating your opinions. Which is exactly the point. If we want our criticisms or opinions to be heard we have to couch them in terms that are acceptable to the person we are criticising or else they either close down and don’t listen or start laughing. You make a valid point, but you make it badly. Hope this helps you grow as a person too.
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Over several decades of watching and listening to unsolicited criticism of others, I have concluded that the vast majority of people who do it are people of low self-esteem who take every opportunity possible to attempt to elevate other peoples’ opinions of them by trying to drag down those whom they criticise to their own self-perceived low levels of worth and esteem. This motivation is most clearly recognisable in individuals by the fact that their unsolicited criticisms are almost always delivered in the presence of third parties.
Often, the critics’ low self-esteem is the product of persistent unnecessary carping criticism of them by their parents when they were children. Thus, this anti-social behaviour of unsolicited public criticism is a vicious inter-generational self-perpetuating cycle that is not infrequently associated with other forms of anti-social behaviour by the critics.
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#55 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
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I’ve always wondered what your column was for and about, and what you were on about. Occasionally, I’ve read one and still been none the wiser. You did, however, dispense advice, in a seemingly benign way but with a degree of arrogance that the wrongly self-assured seem to achieve.
Now the shoe is on the other foot and some one has given you advice; advice you didn’t want or ask for. How does it feel? Seems the smugness you always have has disappeared but not your hubris along with it.
I have noted you carping many times about sharing your feelings with others (and I don’t disagree on this) but when it happens to you, it is “emotional trespass”. You won’t see and probably never will but your hypocrisy is astounding. Your gratuitous advice differs only in the means of delivery but the fundamentals of what is done are similar.
Possibly the affront is because you see yourself as a “good” parent and for some one to not also see it damages your substantial ego.
I won’t read another of your columns and regret the time spent on those I have had the misfortune to read.
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#58 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
Thanks Frank, good to get the other point of view. You remind me of my favourite letter of long ago from a disgruntled reader. It made me laugh. She wrote — and I quote — “I read Ruth Ostrow every week, and I wouldn’t line my budgie cage with her dreadful column.” I hope you do keep reading my ‘dreadful’ column too. Even if only to be appalled by the “arrogance” and “wrongly self-assured smugness” you hate so much. Cheers RO
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You really hit a nerve with your article in this weekend Australian. I had remained close friends with a group of women that I trained (nursing) with in the early sixties, we worked in USA after that and then I came to Australia in 1970 and they all stayed in the same area and in fact went back and took up positions in the hospital we trained in until they retired. I subsequently changed my career direction regularly, moved interstate on a number of occasions with the guy that I have been not married to for 36 years so I think you could say that I have changed somewhat.
In the past 10 years I have arranged 3 week holidays for them on 2 occasions to Australia and it is the last one that really made me identify with your article. The criticism and snide remarks regarding my choice of lifestyle e.g. you drink too much, you are too thin, you hardly eat anything, on and on it went including remarks regarding the treatment for my atrial fibrillation – ‘if you lived in UK you would be made to attend a clinic every week’. No point explaining that I eat very well for a vegetarian or that I go to gym and walk 8 k’s a day and my cardiologist is delighted with my health, it was on for old and young including snide looks when I used the word dinner party instead of tea!!!!
Anyway, recently one of them contacted me as her daughter was immigrating to Adelaide and was it alright for her to contact me, subsequently I helped her and her husband find a flat and this woman has very recently visited them and wanted to take me out for a meal which I accepted. When we were at lunch she said she couldn’t understand why I hadn’t contacted when I was in the UK for my fathers’ funeral, this gave me the opportunity to tell her how upset I had been when nobody even said thanks for the holiday that I had arranged when we went to different airports or made any effort since, I also raised the comments that upset me, our relationship will never be the same as I have changed so much but it was a weight of my shoulders now I no longer have to mull over a situation that had been eating away at me for 4 years.
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Depends on your definition of friend. You never told us what she said, maybe there was some truth in what she said, it seems she hit a nerve. My friends can say what they like its how they say it that makes the difference. I don’t agree with asking permission to speak up, must people don’t want to hear when they need to look at something within themselves that needs attention you can take offence or not but maybe you may learn something about yourself.
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… right to criticise? Sure, it’s a free country, is it polite, that’s a different question.
It is a very general question, people are living in different realities, and they like to be right. Obviously her reality was clashing with yours. If it was too far off, why bother, but if you took it on board, you may have had some self doubt .
Most critcising is meaning less and destructive, it simply serves to elevate someones self-esteem, by making someone else wrong. However, lots of criticism is supportive as well, and out of concern, which still doesn’t determine if it is right or wrong.
My recommendation, stop criticising, by doing it you live in fear of being criticised. -
One of my primary school age sons has always had quite a feisty strong personality (my other children don’t) and I was going through a tough patch dealing with his behaviour. I’d had a particularly challenging morning with him and when I vented to a friend about it she responded with “you know what they say, it’s not the child, it’s the parents.”
I responded gently that her comment really was not very helpful to me as I was already feeling quite down, in the hope that she would apologise and perhaps offer some supportive words instead. She didn’t. Our friendship ended.
In hindsight I should have seen the warning signs. She had on a few occasions related stories to me of her anger and intolerance in some business situations over what to me were relatively minor issues, and also with her family members who she had regular nasty spats with. Needless to say, she hardly has any close friends.
Real lasting friendships and good relationships are based on mutual support and kindness, and when differences of opinion do occur, tact, empathy and forgiveness are essential elements.
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Hello Ruth, I think we can all be judgmental at various times and its rather a case of he who throws the first stone. I look at criticism a little differently. We all have choices and there are certainly times when criticism is a positive thing. Your column is in itself a judgment on those who voice an opinion that differs from yours and has allowed comments to follow that clearly criticise family members in a rather dubious way. If people don’t like their mother-in law, elder sister or whoever, it would be a good idea to look into themselves to see what is happening there. Take the focus off what other people are doing and turn it on oneself. Then see the changes. Voicing how we feel about things in a non critical way is healthy. Maybe the mother-in-law who checks the cooking has a valid point and something can be learned from her.Get positive and stay friendly.
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I’m with you on this one. Coming from a highly critical/judgemental english family I now live on the other side of the world and freely admit I moved to escape the constant judgement.
Since realising how damaging it was to me as a child, I have tried very hard not to inflict my judgement on anyone unless I felt there was serious danger or negative repercussions from their behaviour and even then I’d offer my opinion only once.
As a consequence I often find that people feel freer in my presence and are able to share deeply held secrets and burdens – I’m not a counsellor but sometimes wonder if that is a path I should take.
I firmly believe in live and let live, if you respect your friend/relative then you should allow them to make their own choices in life, let them mold their own path and still support them.
My teenage children are already seeing the difference it has made to their lives and are appreciative of my parenting methods, unlike my friends and family who regularly offer many comments, suggestions, and corrections to my way of life. Looking back I don’t think I would or could change anything to make my children’s and my life any better, so those of you out there thinking of offering… keep your opinions to yourself! -
I noticed you wrote that a friend had given unwanted advice on your parenting. Most friends try to avoid hurting their friends feelings. My mate does not need to know that I think her husband is a mysoginistic prat, or a manipulative drunk because she has to make his dinner regardless of what time he gets home. But I have noticed that as I get older, I want to vent my spleen more (must be hormones you say?, but it happens to men too) and have to tamp down on the urge to tell a few ‘home truths’. On the other side of the scale, perhaps your friend envies your family situation. Or maybe you have precocious brats that get on everyone (else’s) nerves?
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I totally agree with you that there has to be boundaries in every relationship. Your column struck a chord with me as I have had a ‘falling out’ with an old friend in the last week, and I haven’t experienced anything like it since high school. My ‘friend’ sent me an email criticising my husband a few months ago. I responded saying that I could see how she had formed her view, but that it wasn’t fair to expect me to agree or divide my loyalty between her and my husband. This week, she sent another email criticising him and I responded by saying that I thought we had been over this and I was not prepared to be put in a position where I had to defend him to her. (The criticism is petty and antagonistic – nothing serious like him being an alcoholic or wifebeater!). After many days of soul searching, I have come to the conclusion that it’s about how you communicate these things. If it is outright criticism, keep it to yourself. If it is concern that might come across as criticism, then ask an open question. But, don’t ever expect someone to break ranks with a loved one or family member.
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#69 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
That sounds sad Wilma, and often criticism is about being asked to break ranks. And yes often it’s between friends over the partners they choose. i tend to keep quiet until asked. But even that is fraught too, because the friend breaks up and asks what you thought of her newly-ex, and you give your opinion and then the girlfriend ends up back to the ex partner, and tells him what you’ve said, and then you are out in the cold
Its a dangerous game this criticism business.
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I have never commented on my any of my friends’ parenting skills nor on their childrens’ behaviour. If I were to comment it would ruin our friendship. If I find their children unpleasant we don’t see them for a while and I give my kids a break. The only constructive criticism I always ask for is that of my parents. Their love and wisdom has been of great benefit to me and to my children. More people should ask for advice and stop giving it!
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#71 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
Ahhhhh a culprit. How wonderful for you to fess up
Yes it is a personality thing. I don’t mind what people say to me in fact welcome constructive points of view. it is the tone. Really well intentioned observation offered in love and with permission is very different to outright criticism. I can feel it in my gut when it hits. -
I am the villain here, because I am one of the advice-givers. My sister in particular burrs up whenever I proffer an opinion on her or anything. Maybe I’m just an a*&#hole and this is the way a-holes think, but to my mind when I see something that she – to use same sister as an example – is doing or is about to do, and which is either going to result in a stuff-up or can be improved upon, I will say something. The reason I will pipe up and say it is because I can see what she’s doing and how it may be “wrong”, whereas she can’t see – i know she can’t because otherwise she wouldn’t be doing it in the first place. I truly don’t understand what is wrong saying something in a situation like this. Whenever anyone says something in turn to me about something I may doing incorrectly I am acually grateful! I see it as gaining another, new angle on something that I may not have been aware of. Or if it is an angle that I’m already aware of I will promptly tell them so. But I won’t be offended by it. Because I don’t mind criticism, I expect others not to mind it as well. Although clearly many people do mind – a lot! Maybe its a personality thing…
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I had a mother I loved dearly who criticized much of what I did. Now I am a mother, grandmother and mother in law. I am terrified of being critical of people I love as I know how much I was hurt. When asked for advice I hope I give it with the proviso that they know that it is only my opinion and I may be wrong. However, I am human and there are times when I have offered suggestions unsolicited.
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If you have time you can have a look at my own blog and read some of my posts from a Gen X mum of three boys…not always politically correct but worth a laugh
) http://sweet-child-of-mine.tumblr.com/ -
If you really want to see judgmental-ism (inventing words now) at its nastiness try the birth choices and breastfeeding boxing rings!
I heard a loved one -a stay at home mum- saying that working mums and ones who still go to the hair dress…er and buy nice clothes are selfish. Could there really be such a term applicable to mothers? Selfish? Okay I will be selfish if she admits to being crazy because I would have to be crazy to be a SAHM or I soon would be! Ha ha!-
With permission by Ruth- I have a blog on my experience of being a parent of teenage boys called Sweet Child of Mine (yes I am a tragic 80′s chick too). Welcome ‘criticism’ from those who follow Ruth’s blog on mine! http://sweet-child-of-mine.tumblr.com
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Love it Ruth! I have been blogging about my experience of being a mother to teenage boys – raw, truthful and without the notion of if I am doing the ‘right thing’. I am amazed how people are willing to criticize without knowing me, my boys or the situation. Loved ones not so much of a problem though these days! They wouldn’t be game enough! lol
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Me again…I think you have opened a can of worms here Ruth..good luck! Seriously tho both my partner and I come from familys of eight and it is always very interesting . Years ago a dear old friend of mine who died late last year told me of her own grown children who loved her and her husband dearly, that over the years she gave them unconditional love and support throughout their lives no matter what they did, believe me they did plenty, still are! It has been my mantra because never ever underestimate what your children will do just be there to pick them up and point them in the right direction again. People who judge parenting or lifestyle choices-skills probably dont have their finger on the pulse with their children as some one like you has. You and only you will know when things are not quite right and deal with them as you should… friend you say? I dont think so….years ago you did a column on culling friendships, maybe it would be a good time to revisit that? Cheers Kathleen.
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#86 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
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Dear Ruth,
I have found that transcending or avoiding making judgements (on others and also on myself) leads to a great calmness and peacefulness. This tends to have a similar effect on others around me. Judgements cause pain for both the judge and the recipient. Peacefulness and acceptance breeds peacefulness and acceptance. I don’t know how to help others realise this. Personally I found the work of Byron Katie (especially) and Eckhard Tolle (to a lesser extent) to be very helpful, but admitedly only after I had had a fairly major eg0-crisis-meltdown experience (caused by my own judgements and my own reactions to what I perceived were the judgements of others) a couple of years ago. In short, accepting what is is better than seeking to approve or disprove through judgement.
Best wishes,
Angus
P.S. I have not directly answered your questioned, but hopefully my literal answer can be inferred from the above. -
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#90 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
I agree with this Edna but then again I said so in my column. It is incomprehensible to me that this goes on. I have my hands full making decisions that are difficult particularly since I am currently a single mother and don’t have the luxury of being financially supported by a husband. So my daughter has to do without certain things. She is certainly no latch key kid but I am either at work or at university at night (Uni to retrain in multi media so I can stay employable as a journalist and be able to pay for her university and car etc). I feel guilty enough as it is without everyone on my case about my lack of mothering. Especially from friends who have dual incomes. I think my anger is showing, sigh….. trying to make this an unemotional debate but as a mother trying to balance to many balls I just feel tired and the interference does not help!
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I am laughing at both the boys. You have no idea what its like to be a daughter in law of a European mother in law. She tastes everything I make for her darling boy, and then gives me good advice on how i can make it taste better. I find this so distressing I have lost the urge to cook which makes matters worse because i am nervous. Criticism and interfering are bloody awful and achieve no good.
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I know the feeling of being bullied by the wife’s parents. I have used a fake name because I am terrified they will read this and have more to winge and whine about than normal. Honestly, I don’t know where people find the time to be so obstreperous. He is retired, and I think they have more time on their hands than sense.
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I think the topic is good. I live continually with the criticism of my husband who doesn’t think that what I do with the kids is good enough. I am at present a stay at home mum but was a marketing manager for 15 years before I got pregnant. I have two boys, one is a handful due to a medical condition. I do everything I am supposed to do, yet still there are things wrong. not just with how I bring up the kids but also my cooking my weight, and I feel very depressed. He doesn’t see that his criticism is not helping me it is making me feel worse and worse.
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#94 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
Time for some couple’s counselling I think. Specially if you are dealing with a demanding special needs child. Best you try to help yourself and your partner before you end up seriously depressed and in bed, a phenomenon I know too well. As someone who suffers from depression I can see the symptoms. Good luck Lucy from all of us here.
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Hi, using my girl’s address here. Read you and Adams offn’on Adams has actually read my somewhat controversial book on the human condition. You might ask him about it ifn’ you talk at all. Now; without boring you with cliches, I have found that most criticism -qualified or otherwise – is often precipitated by n element of resentment for one or another of your traits, images, successes… whatever. The self appointed critic is scratching their itch in having a whack at you ; ‘ carping’ is so common. And, if the rude assholes really want to help you or whoever you are mistreating there will be obvious signs that they do care. But mostly they don’t and taking you down a notch is much more important. I’ve toughened up in 53yrs and give them my favourite two word monologue starting and finishing with “F”. One more thing, spite and pathetic destructive verbal cruelty is not the preserve of women! I have been the target of ‘opinions’ presented with such vitriol from males – I durnst call them men – that has left me embarrassed on their behalf. I then soon realise that these slobs don’t get how crude they actually are. Mad world huh! Peace, health n’ happiness to you and yours. Stony……
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#97 written by Ruth Ostrow 2 years ago
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Hi Ruth, I am also looking forward to this. I have a sister who is what you would describe as – not shy in coming forth. The other day, for instance, when I was emptying the cupboards for a spring clean, she came over and was standing there commenting on every little thing, clothes I had decided to keep, the fact I am sentimental and don’t like to let old letters go, she was even critical that I had kept a pull over from my Mum who died a few years ago telling me it would just fall apart anyway and I was being a hoarder and that maybe I should seek help. It’s always been like this, and I hope she reads this as I’ve used my real name. I don’t think being the eldest sister gives anyone the right to offer opinions that make a loved one feel belittled or uncomfortable . I look forward to hearing what you say and am happy to share more of these stories tomorrow, if anyone is interested in my family’s dirty linen of course.
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I am looking forward to this one! My mother in law (yes yes cliche) always tells me what to do. I can’t believe it. Everyone at work is frightened of me, due to being in a position of authority. But she feels completely free to share her opinions. I will have a lot to say once I’ve read your story. But another good idea Ruth.
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Thanks everyone for your contribution on this one. A fabulous 100 comments. Most of us feel the same way….Wait for your invitation before entering. Warm wishes Ruth